OK so I was looking at that Midwest kit that was brought up in a previous thread...the one that was like 64 dollars and also had a 25 dollar gift certificate. I finally broke down today and decided to order the kit, which was...no longer available...just my luck.

So, I decided "OK, I still want to buy a 5 gallon kit...but which one?" I am using a Mr.B setup right now, and although it is fun, I want more of a challenge, and bigger batches than what the Mr. B kits give me. This was the start of my confusion. I looked at the midwest website, the austin homebrew website, and frankly I have no idea what I really "need." So, I am at the suggestion of The Professor, opening a thread for input.
Obviously, I am looking for the most bang for my buck, but I don't want to spend 200 bucks on a system. Everyone's input is welcome.
-Thanks!

The kits are nice but personally I think it is better to pick and choose the parts you want and are going to use, you can always add the other parts at another time..

and what you should get will depend on what your goals our and your budget.

DO you want to use carboys, Better bottles, Plastic buckets? DO you want to do all grain, BIAB, Extract with steeping grains, just straight extract?

Do you want to do full boils? partial boils? 3 gallons 5 gallons 10 gallons, 20 gallons....

you get my point...you need to decide what you want and how much you want to spend and then work from there...I will say this...you will end spending more than you think you are going too.....it is a very slippery slope...

If you liked that kit, it comes up every couple of months. I got one about a year ago, although I think it might have been $2 cheaper then.

so you want a 5 gallon system? personally, i like that small batch-size brewing keeps more variety on hand... instead of being saddled with two full cases, you get one case of beer, and you can brew another batch and new recipe next time. they make 3 gallon Better Bottle fermenters... basically plastic carboys.

but, if you want to go five gallon, i would look for a turkey fryer with a pot... the pots are usually 7 or 8 gallons, and fit the 6(ish) gallons of pre boil wort. you can use the pot and burner for extract batch or BIAB... then you can DIY build a mash tun our of a picnic chest cooler (if you want). that'll get you close to a full five gallon all grain setup.

haha, my point precisely! I think for the time being I am leaning more towards either better bottles or plastic buckets. I am trying to avoid the glass, although I do understand that glass although a heck of a lot more dangerous if you drop it, does not scratch as easy; thus less of a chance of contamination (stuff I learned from everyone here).
For the time being I am looking at extracts (I guess for the time being because they are quick and easy), but eventally would like to move up from there.

That is something that I have thought about and discussed in other threads; I do have the turkey fryer setup sitting in the basement right now. I would probably need to buy a new pot (i actually use the pot for frying turkey) but it's nice to already have the burner on hand.

http://www.homebrewing.org/ONE-WELD-9-Gallon-Stainless-Steel-pot_p_1683.html
you can pre-order a 9 gallon SS brewpot... $63. unbeatable price.

and fwiw, i have a three gallon better bottle and love it.

To quickly move to 5 gallons get a 6.5 gallon bucket w/lid and airlock as well as enough bottling capacity. After that, just add piece by piece, like a chiller...

Brew day is pretty much the same for a smaller or larger batch. You'll need a good fermentation area for the larger fermenter and bottling day is a bit longer. Otherwise, yes, it is great to have twice as much beer per batch.

I'll admit that I thoroughly enjoyed brewing different styles of beer from extract kits.

I just bought a 6.5 bucket fermenter and a 6.5 bottling bucket and whatever stuff I thought I needed to start. I didn't want a kit that included anything I already had or anything I did not immediately want.

There are def some differences between brewing a mr beer batch and going to 5 gallon full boils the major one is chilling of the wort, 5 gallons of wort is a lot harder to chill then 2.5 gallons of wort.

You will probably need a wort chiller of some sort

When doing 5 gallon extracts I boiled maybe 2.5 gallons, when doing tweaked Mr. Beer recipes I boiled 1 gallon. In either case I did an ice bath chill and added top off water. A wort chiller is nice but is still not something I have shelled out for in a kit or otherwise, yet.

ok, so I was doing some math online and for this kit http://www.austinhomebrew.com/product_info.php?cPath=178_33_52&products_id=12735 they charge like 78 and some change. I did the math, and some scrubbing against my brain (and a local hardware store) and I am pretty sure that I can build the exact same kit, using food quality plastic and a bit of elbow grease and achieve the same kit for about 30 bucks. What do you guys think? Do I go for it?
IMO if I dork something up, I am only out about 30 bucks...but devils advocate says that is 30 bucks that I could apply to a kit that is already built...I dunno...what do you guys think?

You might pick up or make a fermentor and bottling bucket for cheaper but all those extras add up about right. Unless you are only looking for a fermentor then buy the whole kit if you can it has everything you need.

Otherwise buying it all individually might not save anthining. But I'm kinda confused since there's no way to duplicate that kit for $30.

This is basically what I pieced together for myself:

6.5 gallon plastic primary fermenter with a lid ($14)
3-piece airlock ($2)
5 gallon Bottling bucket (free at bakery) with spigot ($4)
6 feet of Siphon Hose ($3)
Racking cane ($6)
fermtech bottle filler ($3)
Black Beauty Bottle Capper ($15)
Bottle brush ($3)

That's roughly $50...

You will still need sanitizer and bottle caps for each batch.

ok so this is what I was considering:
2x5 gallon buckets: 3.97 (local lowes)
1 Lid (fermentation) 1.47 (local lowes)
1 spigot 3/8in (bot. bucket) 3.69 (austin homebrew)
1 3 pc airlock 1.29 (austin homebrew)
1 airlock grommet .79 (austin homebrew)
1 siphon kit (3/8in) 11.99 (austin homebrew)

Shipping and handling for the stuff I get from Austin is 7.99 flat rate. the buckets I pick up locally from the Lowes here in town, so no charge for S&H. I have the drill and bits to fit th spigot also. Total cost: 35.16 plus tax. I have everything else in the kit; the bottle capper, bottle caps, etc. from previous purchases. Also from what I have read, i wouldn't be the first to use this style of bucket for fermentation/bottling. What do you all think?

FYI this is the bucket that I am looking at:

http://www.lowes.com/pd_356492-1152-51640_4294766270_4294937087_?productId=3382564&Ns=p_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_qty_sales_dollar|1&pl=1&currentURL=%2Fpl_Buckets_4294766270_4294937087_%3FNs%3Dp_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr%7C0%7C%7Cp_product_qty_sales_dollar%7C1&facetInfo=

In the case that you already have the extras in that kit, then yeah, build you a cheap fermentor and bottling bucket...cheap and easy. Those lowes buckets are FDA approved. Polyethelyne is a very common plastic, but there are many different forms of it. By being FDA approved, I don't think thats counting it food grade, but the resins in the plastic are FDA approved.

I say go for it, but others might have more experience with them.

Keep in mind that with a 5 gallon bucket, you can't brew 5 gallon catches. I bought a 5 gallon bucket from Walmart (food grade) and use it for 4 gallon batches.

Lowe's and Home Depot buckets probably won't work. Too many People have reported plasticy off flavors when using those buckets that magically disappear when they start fermenting in something else. I'd avoid them as fermenters.

+1 do not use the lowes or home depot buckets...

Keep in mind all plastics are not created equal...

I think a better idea is to sit down and figure out a price up front you're willing to spend. Too many people will go shopping for say a car and THEN go home and see how to wiggle it into their budget. Determine your budget first.

Then when buying equipment, think of upgrades. If you're planning on buying something now that will possibly need upgraded later, is it really cheaper to buy it? Maybe it would be cheaper in the long run to start off with the upgrade.

With that being said, go brew pot first. You will probably need a pot large enough to do a full wort boil for a 5 gallon brew. Don't knock it out of the park with a Blichmann or anything. But, if cost really is a factor all grain brewing is way cheaper than any form of extract and you'll need that larger pot. You may not be there yet, but it sounds like your path might lead you to AG.

Fermenters... I priced them through Northern Brewer. They have flat rate shipping too. A 6 gallon Better Bottle with a drilled stopper, 3 piece airlock, and fermometer on the side was $33.68. A 6.5 gallon bucket with the grommeted lid, 3 piece airlock, and fermometer was $24.07. Plastic is what plastic is and it will eventually need to be replaced. However, I'm betting the Better Bottle easily outlasts (scratch free) the bucket. Consider light restriction too. Where will you ferment? The buckets will keep light out. If you plan on brewing anything that might need to sit in a fermenter for several weeks maybe even a few months, you don't want buckets. Better Bottles are impermeable to oxygen.

I noticed the Lowes food grade bucket a while ago, which is different than the regular Lowes and Homer buckets. While the Lowes bucket (food grade) would be fine, I don't know that they sell a food grade lid for it. (I use free and $2 buckets with lids from the local markets, mostly for 4 gal batches)

btw - while at Lowes/HD, you may want to pick up a PVC elbow for the bottling bucket, as shown in this thread:
Bottling_Bucket

For spigots and airlocks, a local homebrew shop would be good, if you have one - good to support and save on s&h. I'm pretty lucky in that regard.

I'm not sure what's in a siphoning kit for $11.99. If you have a few feet of tubing, you can siphon/rack your beer. I guess a cane may be nice, particularly if you use a carboy, but I've never used one.

And while on the topic of econo-brewing...
- Bleach can be used as an effective, inexpensive and readily available no-rinse sanitizer (follow threads on using it with water and vinegar).
- "no-chill" brewing is an option to consider - no wort chiller required.
- the money you save by not buying stuff you may not need can go toward buying a grain mill. $20-30 for a mill opens the option of bulk grains.

Since you want more of a challenge than MrB and seem to be budget minded, I'd say look into all-grain using brew-in-a-bag. It's a very low cost challenge, and you can decide how you want to scale up your batch size as you go along. You can probably start with a paint strainer bag and ferment in your existing MrB keg(s). This looks like a good option for an inexpensive ($30, free s&h) brew pot for larger than MrB size brewing:
32-Quart Aluminum with Lid

Cheers

I started out using spigots but the occasional leak forced me to fill them with water for a leak test before use which was more work and wasted water. Now I use plain buckets and an auto siphon.

My first pot purchase was a 22qt. It was OK for Mr. Beer batches but woefully undersized for 5 gallon batches so it is now my HLT. I bought a cheap 7 gallon kettle and it has been working great for over two years now. Maybe not as $exy as a Blichmann but much less expensive.

After much debate, and actually going out to different stores and physically looking at stuff, I have decided that I am probably going to buy a kit of sorts; but there were very valid points in this thread that I am taking into consideration:

1. Stop thinking so much about the fermentation process, and think about how you are going to get there first. i.e. a brew pot, materials, etc.
2. 5 gallon buckets from lowes although they may be a plausible option, probably aren't going to cut the mustard the way I expect them to. I remember reading somewhere that scratches in the plastic can cause unwanted toxins to enter into your mix, thus contaminating your beer. This is something that I need to be very wary of, when it comes to "building" a bottling bucket.
3. Someone had mentioned, buying a kit that is going to last...this makes sense and speaks for itself obviously. I guess if you are going to get into a hobby...rather if you are already into a hobby and you really enjoy it, invest in it properly and make sure that your equipment will last.
4. Not all kits are made for everyone. For example, there was stuff that I saw in the Austin Homebrew kits that I didn't need, but I would be paying for anyway. Why not just buy the stuff that I want, and build my own kit? This leads me to my final point:
5. Whenever possible, support your local homebrew store. This hobby although very new to a lot of people in prospective of hobbies in the last 30 years, is still in a very fragile state; and the internet doesn't help. The little guy up the road from me (although it will take me 45 minutes of conversation to purchase my kit) only operates 4 days out of the week, and 4 to 5 hours each day that he is open; obviously because he can't afford to stay open 7 days out of the week, and he is vesting his time and money in his small business...frankly living like a candle in the wind holding onto what used to be the "american dream."

So, if you took the time to read my drunken afternoon rambling, I will be buying the equipment that I need...not necessarily a kit. Furthermore, after running into my local home brew store guy on the whim chance that he was open (not for business necessarily, but he still catered to my questions) I will be buying from my little local brew supply store.

Salud!

Very well said.

I agree on supporting your LHBS whenever possible. If you don't, it won't be there.

Sounds good!